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Raised By Her Podcast
Raised By Her is a mother–daughter podcast exploring the lessons, love, and lived experiences passed down through generations. Hosts Ro Nita and Donnica share honest, intergenerational conversations about womanhood, identity, family, and leadership - and the wisdom we inherit (and sometimes challenge).
Part humor and all heart, Raised By Her is a reminder that every generation has something to teach—and that the stories that raise us continue to shape who we become.
Raised By Her Podcast
Burnout, Self-Care, and Ambition for High-Achieving Women | Raised by Her
Are you exhausted from high achievement—or struggling to communicate effectively at work?
In this episode of Raised by Her, we unpack why being “direct” isn’t always effective, explore the dark side of the Enneagram Type 3, and reflect on what it really takes to move into 2026 without burning out.
Through an honest mother–daughter conversation, we reflect on the challenges of 2025 and set the stage for a more intentional, sustainable approach to ambition, leadership, and self-care. If you’ve ever felt the physical toll of stress, the guilt of slowing down, or the pressure to always perform, this episode is for you.
We dive deep into:
- High achievement, burnout, and Enneagram Type 3 tendencies
- Why “being direct” can cross into being perceived as rude at work
- How small shifts in communication (yes—even a smiley face) can change outcomes
- Mentorship, manifestation, and meeting your heroes
- Generational differences in work, style, and success
- The rise of the day party and redefining joy at every age
Whether you’re navigating leadership, corporate communication, or personal growth—or just want a thoughtful (and funny) conversation between a mother and daughter—this episode offers wisdom, reflection, and forward momentum.
⏱️ Episode Timestamps
- 0:00 – Surviving the chaos of 2025
- 1:48 – What your body tells you about stress
- 3:33 – How to raise unapologetic daughters
- 5:02 – The dark side of being an Enneagram 3
- 6:36 – Are you living in the past?
- 10:44 – How I manifested my dream mentor
- 13:02 – The truth about meeting your heroes
- 18:42 – Direct vs. rude: a hard lesson in communication
- 22:04 – The “smiley face” rule in corporate emails
- 29:14 – Advice on “trying” vs. doing
- 32:36 – Why day parties are superior (at any age)
- 40:10 – Millennial comfort vs. boomer style
🎤 New episodes every week. Honest conversations between mother and daughter on family, womanhood, and navigating life across generations.
Speaking, partnerships, and press: raisedbyherpodcast@gmail.com.
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Welcome back to Raised by Her. Please feel free to like and subscribe.
SPEAKER_02:We are back for another week. Yes, we are. Getting ready for that new year, huh?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. How are you feeling going into 2026?
SPEAKER_02:I'm feeling great. All these wonderful, exciting new things. Our podcast is doing wonderful. We're spending more time together just really relating to all these different things going on in the world, some things that have been pretty challenging, and yet we have the support of one another.
SPEAKER_03:And so how do you feel like 2025 was?
SPEAKER_02:2025 was for you.
SPEAKER_03:I mean, that that right that is a general university. No, not necessarily narrowly. How was 2025 for you?
SPEAKER_02:Um for me, I think it was uh sort of a mixed bag. Okay. Um, I think that uh the challenges of some things we had talked about at the beginning of of the year, um, having lost your dad and and really um really navigating through that situation. And then my mom passing mid-year was was difficult. A lot of loss this year. A lot of loss. And we had to to figure out, I think, how to be able to navigate our lives in a different world without loved ones. Yeah, with those gaps. And so um, so but we made it, we are here, and um, God is good, and I'm looking forward to just moving beyond the challenges of 2025.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, so you're like, it was a year, it's over, thankful for that, looking forward to what the future holds, like happy to be through 2025 and looking forward into 2026. Okay.
SPEAKER_02:I had a a um person, a massage therapist, say to me that uh what she can tell from uh working on my body and the tension is that um my joints, uh, my muscles, and uh how my body is sort of responding is more relaxed now than it was uh several months ago when she started doing um. And so that's the benefit of having someone that you go to on a regular basis because they can really, I think they can tell what's going on.
SPEAKER_03:So well, congratulations on being able to relax some because it's not easy to do, maybe it's just not easy for me, but it's not necessarily easy to do. And so the fact that she's like, oh, I can tell that you're coming in more, I don't know if it's more flexible, more mobile, maybe all of the above.
SPEAKER_02:I think it's all of the above, but she said she knew it was intentional as well, because uh something we talk about often is is paying attention and the whole idea of self-care. And so I think all of that is is making a difference. And I think that it's important for us as women to be able to identify what we want and then not to feel guilty about the fact that we are giving ourselves that part something that we want or we need because that guilt thing is real.
SPEAKER_03:I hear a lot of people talking about it. I wonder, but I I'm sometimes I can relate to it, but oftentimes I can't. Maybe it's a result of me watching you go through whatever journey that is, but I I feel like I can be quite unapologetic about what it is I want, and it's not always in line with society expectations or familial expectations, but I'm also like, but this is my life.
SPEAKER_02:Well, and uh that's actually what uh she and I were talking about. How do you have an opportunity to raise daughters who feel that way? Because she has two daughters, and I said it has to be intentional for them to be able to do that.
SPEAKER_03:I think you have to set the example, probably, because that's that's the only way I would have learned otherwise. I would have leaned into the broader narrative of what women should do and then feel guilty all the time.
SPEAKER_02:You have to use your talents and skills, you must use the opportunities that come your way, and you have to be able to be adventurous and take some chances and some risks. And all of that sounds good, but really I I've tried my best to be able to demonstrate that. And I think you've succeeded. Yes, you are quite the risk taker. Thank you. Yeah, well, but the best part of all of that is that you absolutely don't look back and go, I wish I had. Oh, I wished I had done that. This is an opportunity to be able to say, I'm so glad I did, or I I tried it, it didn't work out. Okay. All right.
SPEAKER_03:And that's okay. Because then you can still move forward. You know that you tried, and yeah, you can Yeah, be you and do you. Um, that's a that's such a good point, actually. So I was um in one of my mentorship groups and talking to my mentor one-on-one, actually, because everybody else um had had conflicts, and so I was like, Yes, I get you all to myself. And so I got some personalized time, which always makes me really happy. And so we were able to kind of kind of dive deeper into to me in my 2025. And so one of the things that we've done is we've taken an ideogram personality test. Okay. And so it it rank is the wrong word, but um, after taking a series of questions, yes, thank you. You identify with a certain number, and so you can be this number or that number, and I'm a three, okay, which is a high achiever. And I think there which shocks everybody around me. No, not really. And uh, so she was uh she's actually um also a three. And one of the things that we do um outside of kind of burning ourselves. Oh no, let me let me back up. So I was talking to her about my 2025 and how it had been very fast paced, I had done a lot, I feel good about it, but I am exhausted. And she was like, Well, why don't you just kind of pause or rest? And there's no better time than the the next um than this time because things have slowed down as folks are um, you know, into the new year and everything. And I was like, I get that, but a part of me not slowing down is that I remain really excited about the future. And so I want to keep going and doing. And I feel like if I pause or I stop, um, it's a lot of looking back and reflection. And I've meet so many people that they they just talk about what was and what used to be. And to me, like you're living your lives are living in the past, whereas like, but there's a whole present and a whole future that you have to continue to just build and go. So we kind of talked through some of that. And she was actually like, I know exactly what you're talking about. I was in a meeting with uh a CEO who was talking to the new CEO of this Fortune 50 company, and he was talking about the specific names of the people he worked on and all these amazing things that he had done. And the new CEO was looking at him like, Who are these like, what are you talking about? He was talking about people from the 1990s.
SPEAKER_02:Are you kidding me?
SPEAKER_03:This new, he has no idea what you know, and so it's um okay anyway. It was a really it was a good session for me as I really work on my ability to not burn out and also pause, reflect, and then use those reflections to help me move forward in uh an intentional and a meaningful and impactful way.
SPEAKER_02:A friend of mine often says that when uh when he's talking to me and I seem busy, I seem engaged, and I seem most of the time like I'm enjoying myself and what it is that I'm doing. I said, Well, I'm I'm retired from that um 50 to 60 hour work week. Are you? Well, yes, I am. Okay, all right. If you say so. I know, I know. Uh but um it it's a different kind of of busy um in in terms of the things that I am choosing to do and things I'm uh choosing to learn and how to be able to kind of go to the next step. And when I hear you talk about high achieving, I don't there's nothing wrong with that. And you do have to take the time to make sure you're not missing something. Because if you miss it, then maybe a while before that opportunity comes back again. But if if it's meant for you, it will come back. I do know that the universe actually has this game plan. You are supposed to do certain things, but if you miss it, then it may take longer, but that's okay too.
SPEAKER_03:Well, she encouraged me to go back and like reread the profile, both the pros and the cons. Okay. Um, also working on vulnerability um is something to watch for too. There's there's two or three other things that I can't remember, but uh it was how it was it was a good reminder because I hadn't gone back and look gone back to look at it for a while. And so I was like, okay, yes, I yes, yes, yes, okay. I I get it, I hear you as I'm contemplating what my word is going to be for 2026 as we go into this new year.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Have you figured out? Uh are you getting close? Are we down to like the top three words or um so yes, I'm close.
SPEAKER_03:Similar to my process last year, there's a word that has come to me. It came to me in a yoga class, actually. And then I was like, oh my gosh, you've mentioned this to me. Oh my gosh, my therapist has mentioned to me. Oh my gosh, my executive coach has mentioned. But I was like, I'm not I'm not comfortable with that. We have to figure out another way to do it.
SPEAKER_02:One of those kind of words. Yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So we'll we'll see. I will make the decision by uh the middle to end of January.
SPEAKER_02:So you don't have to have that word by January 1st.
SPEAKER_03:Um, I do this exercise with a broader group. And so um, I will announce what my word is on this podcast after I've had that meeting with them. But we meet probably towards the middle um of the month, every month. And so once a support group, it's a mentorship group.
SPEAKER_02:Okay.
SPEAKER_03:Um it's national. There's women from all over, well, there's only five of us. And we were selected several years ago for um a mentorship program uh that was only supposed to last for uh was it six months or a year? And now we are in year four. And we we don't just meet virtually, we also um every year, at least once or twice a year, meet in person as well. And so it's we we are beyond it's beyond a mentorship group now, actually. We're we're family and we're and we're sisters and it's oh that's great. Yeah, it's it's it is great.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, it it's great because you connected and you made the decision that you're going to stay connected, all five of you.
SPEAKER_03:All five of us. And now we all know that this comes down to our to our leader, um, that leadership really drives this. And so absolutely all five of us are really connected. But then our mentor um is the one who who you know we follow and we ask, and she just just she's helped us tremendously throughout our lives thus far.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, I'm gonna rewind here because I remember having a conversation with you when you were still living in Washington, D.C. Yeah, about uh a woman that you had read about that um you said, I really want to meet this woman at some particular time. And you started telling me about why you wanted to meet her and what her career had been like, and some things that you had read that um that really excited you about this particular individual. And I said to you, well, at some point, at the right time, this will manifest because this is something you really seem intentional about. How long from that point um did it take before this person showed up? Oh do you remember that?
SPEAKER_03:Such a good memory, such a yeah. So it was probably uh at least two or three years. You know, I I said those things, I mentioned it, and then I, you know, I went about my career, and then I saw this opportunity through this organization for executive women in communications, women of color in communications, and they had launched this inaugural mentorship program. And I was like, oh, okay, um, I'll just apply and see what happens. I didn't know who the well, we did have an idea of who um I think there were like seven to eight mentors from around the country.
SPEAKER_02:It was a caliber of women in a certain kind of yeah, you had to be C-suite.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, yeah, for sure. Um, and but we I don't I didn't know that ahead of uh I knew that it was gonna be C-suite women. I didn't know exactly who these women were going to be. That's exactly right.
SPEAKER_02:I remember you're telling me about the application process and the whole thing.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, I mean, and they got for that first year hundreds and hundreds of or no, no, no, like did they hit a thousand? I don't know. They got several applications. They selected 200 um and then split us up um in between the different mentors. And that woman who I was manifesting apparently uh several years later ended up being my my mentor and not just for that particular, well, I guess it was for that particular program, but it's a program that uh will now ideally last forever.
SPEAKER_02:So from that particular um manifestation into your life, you not only connected with that woman, but you also have four more sisters that you've connected to in life. See, isn't life grant? See, it is really you know what's the coolest thing about that though?
SPEAKER_03:Because you know how there's like this saying where you don't want to meet your heroes? Um, she is every bit as cool and authentic and helpful. She is everything that I would have wanted her to be, which I think is really, really cool. Because that doesn't always happen. Because people say, like, don't meet your heroes. I won't say she will she's a hero to me now, you know.
SPEAKER_02:Right. Well, I think that I believe, and I'm going to interpret that, don't meet your heroes. Have you heard that before, though? I I have heard it, I've heard people refer to it. Okay. I have not heard it in a speech or presentation specifically where it is explained. Okay. So um, how do you interpret that? But let me let me ask that question before I give you my opinion.
SPEAKER_03:I think people say that because um you build people up to a certain um level or expectation, and then you meet them and they uh, you know, they don't meet those expectations. They're either rude or they're mean, but you're building something out over something and you don't know them. So you're just you're looking at either what they're putting out to the media or social or whatever it is you think in your head, and then whatever's in your head doesn't always um, you know, manifest into reality. And so I think when that happens, that's what's disappointing to people. So for example, when if you have like, if you're a child and you love basketball and you're like, oh, I want to meet um, you know, Michael Jordan or something, and then you meet him and he and he doesn't sign, you know, your your poster or whatever, and he's he and he's rude or he's mean, then you're like, oh, well, you know, then that breaks your heart. It breaks the kid's heart. Because that was his hero, you know, he'd be looking up to him, then he's like, uh.
SPEAKER_02:I had someone say to me recently that she used to listen to me when she was a little girl um on the radio, and now here she is, a grown woman, a professional woman who is doing very well. And she said, I'm having the opportunity to now be up close and personal with someone that um I really admired when I was a little girl. And she said, Do you know how cool that is? And I said, Um, well, thank you for admiring me. Um, I I started out when I was really young. You see that a lot though.
SPEAKER_03:People come up to you a lot and then say that they admire you. But it is cool to be able to have that full circle moment.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, I think so. I I I think because And for people to tell you too. I'm I'm glad that she told you. I was gonna say that was just very meaningful to me because what what I believe that I was doing is I was doing what I was supposed to be doing and hopefully uh being able to touch lives in a positive way, but also to encourage young women, and I guess in this case, little girls too, to uh have a voice and to speak out. That was a part of my mission at that particular time, so that you can grow and be and do, um, but also speak out because we have especially, I mean, I I grew up in the 50s and 60s, so you weren't always encouraged to I feel like it's probably a really gentle way of saying that.
SPEAKER_03:We weren't always encouraged. I think y'all were fighting out told to well, that's what is it? Shut up.
SPEAKER_01:Yes, yes, yeah. Be seen and not heard.
SPEAKER_02:Be seen and not heard, Lord, yes, that one. Yes. Um, but so it was it was important to me. But that's really a part of what your grandmother would say too. You know, if you have a voice and you have an opinion, then make sure that you express it. Because if you don't, that opportunity will miss. Um, you will have you will not have that opportunity again, and it's a missed experience.
SPEAKER_03:I also think just like tell people how you feel. I was in um a meeting this week and it everything was it was going really well and everything, but the energy of this person who I admire a ton was was like a little off. And so I ended up sending him a follow-up note, just like thanking him for all the things that we had done, all the things that we're going to do in the future, and then also just like telling him about what I had heard about him around the community because he's had such a positive impact. And he was like, Donica, you just don't know. Like, thank you. Um but I was so on the fence, I was like, I don't really know how appropriate this is, you know, because you're just like, I don't, we we know each other, we won't quite know each other like that. And I was like, just send the email, you know, just just tell him how you feel.
SPEAKER_02:Just go ahead and I was my promise. See, take your voice and and speak it. Yeah, and also people can receive it however they want to. They can receive it in the way that you mean it, they can receive it based upon the fact of what they are conjuring up in their mind, or the day they're having. Or yes, and and that may have been uh just not only what that person needed, but also um because leadership is hard. Leadership is hard, especially good leadership and authenticity. Yeah. Um, so um that's like someone said to me um recently. I express myself and then I'm wondering, should I said that, is this uh going to be an opportunity where uh the person would take what it I said along the wrong way? And I said, Isn't that up to the other person how they take it?
SPEAKER_03:You're you're so right, but I just I can relate to that because I second guess myself less now than I used to, but I still I still do it. So uh particularly as I'm working on being more vulnerable and those types of things, I'll say that I'll say something. I'm like, no, I shouldn't have mm-mm. No, that's not gonna oh.
SPEAKER_02:Well, you're not you're not supposed to be unkind. Um, you know, you're you you are supposed to be kind, uh, or you are supposed to speak your truth, but you're supposed to be able to hopefully help in the situation and not make the situation worse. I think that's where we get caught up. I think if you're saying something and it's hurtful to the other person, that's not good because then you're not helping that person to maybe move to a new space that he or she might need to move to or want to move to and maybe not even knowing.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah. No, no, that's a really good point. I uh uh many years ago I had a therapist tell me, uh, because I I am quite direct. Really? Yeah.
SPEAKER_02:And and I I Yes, you are, you know, because you've been that way most of your your life.
SPEAKER_03:Okay, okay. Uh yeah, I just and and as I reflect on it as an adult, I'm like, well, what what are we what are we, you know, going around words for? Like, this is what needs to be done. Let's say the things and let's get it done. Um, and so I'm like, you know, I can just be brutally honest. And my therapist was like, why do we have to be brutal? You know, why can't we just be honest? And I was like, I had never thought of it that way, but but you're right, that is an excellent reframing of how to just like be direct, be honest, but like, you know, just maybe take a little bit of the edge off.
SPEAKER_02:I can so relate to to that um that particular comment, and thank you to the therapist for sharing that with you. Yeah, she's awesome too.
SPEAKER_00:She's that a London.
SPEAKER_02:This this time in my life where I was uh was working in public television and the general manager um uh called me into the office. I was producing a show and uh he called me into the office and he said, Um, I have something for you. And he gives me a copy of a memo that I had written to the rest of the production staff. And he had it all marked up with these red marks and and different words. And I said, What did you do to what did you?
SPEAKER_03:do to my memo and he said um you really upset some of the people that you work with and i said i i i didn't mean to upset them i'm i'm a producer of the program i'm supposed to have a certain kind of standard and you like the program and he said i'm not really uh upset about what you said i'm upset about uh how you said it and when you take this memo i want you to go back i want you to look at the comments that i have written and uh as just an exercise i want you to rewrite this memo so i begrudgingly i did it i brought it back to him at some particular um moment and he said now you said the exact same thing and how you said it was in a kinder and gentler uh uh manner and if your team had received it in this way they would not have been upset and someone coming to me hit and this is written communication yes I feel like that's even harder um I mean for uh like so it it's because you never you don't know how someone's gonna take it you don't know how someone's gonna take it it's like reading a text message versus reading email versus right um you know what you would have benefited from it's something that I benefit from now like I'll draft an email then I'll put it in chat GPT and be like make this nicer.
SPEAKER_02:Yeah so we didn't even we didn't even have computers that had any idea you were having to have a typewriter that's exactly right so uh yeah this that was I'm just saying it would have helped it it would have helped um but it was a really good management lesson for me because this was early on in my career and I mean it was the really the same thing it was just said in a different a kinder gentler way so I learned something from the experience my feelings were hurt I mean I was called into the general manager's office but um yeah I did learn something I also think it depends though like on the end and it depends on the industry as well so when I um I started my well early my career was on Capitol Hill and then I transitioned into um multinational companies and corporate and so uh one of my bosses came to me at some point was like your emails are just really direct and I was like well how would you how would you want me to to say it differently and she was like well can you add in a smiley face or something?
SPEAKER_03:What? And I was like ma'am I came from Capitol Hill. There are no smiley faces on Capitol Hill. Like what are you asking me to do that to the side room so I did eventually have to edit myself into corporate speak but I think but that wouldn't fly you know as a lawyer on Capitol Hill either. So I also think it's just like in my directness there I probably piece of it obviously is just like who I am but also it's how I was trained. You know the literal literal language matters.
SPEAKER_02:The idea of of excellence and the idea of how you communicated I think is what both bosses were trying to tell us you probably 50 years later after after my generational issue is that I think it's not only a generational issue but I think it's it's a communication issue with how you're using your words. So um just like there are no smiley faces on them. Yeah I'm like what are you talking about everybody it it took me a while to um to navigate into the corporate sphere if I ever truly did that it's probably still no I think you did um because I I think the promotions that you received and I think um you had individuals that reached out to you um going from one company to another champions as well yeah so I I I think yeah it it works. So I worked out I learned along the way well I think we all do if we pay attention yeah I think that's good.
SPEAKER_03:I we I use smiley faces now.
SPEAKER_02:See?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah I do too even in memos all right so that's one of the things we're gonna take into 2026 with us we are going to use some smiley faces in 2026 as we soften as we continue to soften a little bit.
SPEAKER_02:I think that's good. Yeah um do you do resolutions?
SPEAKER_03:I don't do resolutions um I don't know if I ever did resolutions in a serious way I feel like that's something that's impressed upon you as something that people do early on and so I think I probably tried at the beginning of the year many years ago but it's not something I ever took seriously. What about you?
SPEAKER_02:Um the exact same yeah um I would say I'm going to do certain kinds of things you know I'm gonna lose 25 pounds and I'm going to go to the gym three times a week and you know those things and that might last maybe a month or two or I'm going to um eat more spinach whatever whatever the the whole thing. I will tell you that that um I read about um a woman who decided that she was going to do more writing of letters that we have become a society now that corresponds very quickly in our emails or whatever kind of communication is short, sweet and to the point. And she said she had letters that um her grandmother and her mother had written her and then she thought my children have no idea of nice long letters and um so she decided to to do that and it made such a difference in the communication between her and her children.
SPEAKER_03:That's interesting.
SPEAKER_02:And uh and she said it was sort of like journaling but also with the intent of sharing either the experience or sharing her personality with her uh her offspring. And then and she said and when I'm no longer here just like I have the letters that my mother wrote me or my and my grandmother wrote um they'll have something that is uh to remember me by in a certain kind of sweet that yeah and so I thought you know that's a it's not a resolution that was uh something that she did intentionally but it could only be beneficial.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah I mean that that reminds me of um my father was sick before he passed away in that final year I was looking for ways to kind of capture some of his stories and um things like that. So they have all types of different services out there that um I don't know if they're letter writing services per se, but like their voice. And so you can record memories there's like different prompts and you can do it strictly digitally you can do it um you can record it in some other ways. And so it's uh cool there are a lot of different services out there people are looking for different ways to to tell their stories either for themselves or for others or for their children or um yeah it's a that's a cool activity to do very meaningful generationally I think so generationally yeah I mean because that's you're not just doing I it depends on what you're recording I suppose but I can see how a child would really enjoy that or like grandchildren would be really interested to see what oh what was my grandmother's personality when she was in her 40s or in her 30s or 50s or whatever.
SPEAKER_02:Keep that in mind.
SPEAKER_03:Oh okay like because we need another thing you record well we might you know hey hey this is oh my goodness age of of digital communication what can we say yeah but it's I would um just also add some context that it's not from my perspective is not as easy as just like it has to be one of your favorite words is intentional but it it takes time and effort and thoughtfulness and then you also have to have the literacy to navigate the digital tools like I did make it probably seem simpler than I mean I'm sure the companies make it as simple as possible but like it's also it's it's extra work.
SPEAKER_02:And that's okay.
SPEAKER_03:We know that you you do not mind extra work.
SPEAKER_02:You well I know that that in order to reach a goal you have to put work into it.
SPEAKER_03:That's true. That's true. Right. If it's something that you really want to do then yeah you can get it done. Yeah so keep that in mind that's true. I think it's that want piece it's that is it is it what you want is it how you want to spend your time. Right. Right because we all have the same 24 hours every day even though some people think that maybe that you have 28 hours because you're up at what five o'clock in the morning going to the gym which is a choice yeah yeah no I I love that reminder that everybody has 24 hours in a day. When people the same yes absolutely because when people are like I'm I'm busy you and I actually had this conversation because we were talking about how um everybody's perspective of success is different. But I have found um in my life thus far the people who I view as the most successful they respond the fastest they are the quickest they it's it's not oh I'll like you know two weeks late like things just get done at a pace. And I was like that's something that's how you can get so much stuff done in 24 hours. It's not whatever else you know I don't I differ people operate differently but that's always at the top of my mind. And it's something I look for um when I'm working with people I'm like how fast are you to to respond?
SPEAKER_02:I just um watched an interview with uh Melody uh Hobson um she is a financial wizard she's African American woman who is um one of the experts um in terms of financial advising oh yeah she's everything I follow her on Instagram okay well um she's also married to George Lucas she's married to George Lucas which probably is one of the least interesting things about her which is really cool which I was saying that's how amazing she is that that is absolutely how amazing she is and um years ago when I was in broadcasting she um too was also she was an investor and so we were on a panel together and I remember that not only and she was a little woman she was slight and and uh but she was powerful with her presentation and her advice and a part of what I I was really impressed by is how much she knew about the financial world. And I'm thinking um she's an owner I'm an owner but she sounded like she knew so much and she did um because of her background and her experience. A part of what she thought was really important is for not only women to be more informed but to study and she said work hard at it now because if you work hard at it now later in life it will come easy to you. So when you're talking about working and working hard it just reminds me of that being a part of her advice. Also in the recent interview that um that I was watching um she said this was this was funny to me she said I eliminated the word try.
SPEAKER_03:You either do it or you don't that is something from Star Wars from Yoda as well there is no try. I actually I heard that in middle school um and I I started reciting it to some teachers and I got in trouble. What? Yeah you got into trouble because they said that wasn't reality.
SPEAKER_02:Well I think her well I know her point was that she has used that advice and it's funny because um during the interview they showed the picture of Yoda.
SPEAKER_03:Oh did they okay yeah yeah it's still excellent advice though I I dismiss what my middle school teacher I can yes I dismiss that in totality.
SPEAKER_02:But I agree I was thinking about it and then I wrote it down and I I I began to just say you know what that makes such sense because when you say I will try that gives you an out what Melody was talking about is there is no out. Either you do it or you don't or you don't and so I was reminded of of that so such a cool sister. I mean she um they ask her about being married to to uh George Lucas and someone who is highly creative and so successful and she said we've had a good life because we compliment each other in terms of our skill sets um but he allows me to be me and I'm now not the only black girl in the in the group there are many others yeah now but back when they first got together um they were pretty unique.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah yeah cool couple yeah it is pretty good so let's see other things in 2027 wait you have an upcoming party I do yes and we were talking about this because it's a little different than how you usually party yes it's a day party you are the partier between the two of us by the way I also I love that for you well I I'm uh I I said I was going to get out more and do more and be similar to the old me.
SPEAKER_02:Okay, okay so although this is the new me but yeah that's right but um so a day party and uh it was cool because the idea is to start partying at 11 o'clock and then go into early afternoon. And I had heard about young people doing this but I have was not familiar with people who are in their 50s 60s like 9 p.m or 10 p.m no five or six or so five or six okay okay but uh this is it's you know it's a cool experience one you're not tired two you have an opportunity to do all the same things that you do later at night and are you familiar with day parties?
SPEAKER_03:Yeah um I would say I became most familiar with them in college there's a massive brunch culture and in the larger cities so um excellent brunches in Atlanta excellent brunches in DC uh and so that obviously stems around the day. Now I will say if you spend your um 10 a.m to 3 p.m hours drinking mimosas and eating omelets it does make for a challenging evening you know I mean then you were done for the day. Right, right yes yes yes I mean there's some folks that persevered and could go but that that was not me. I I have um one activity in me so we are either in the day party or the night party but I prefer I prefer a day party for that reason and I think but that's changed. I used to I used to love nighttime in my 20s um and early 30s I enjoyed like being out at night but now I'm I I could be at your 70s 80s 60s um day party.
SPEAKER_02:Well the the fact that you're out doing the line dances and it's you know one o'clock in the afternoon and you know everybody's moving and all dressed up because the attire it's make sure that you uh you know you look holiday festive and all of those things so it was kind of cool but I will tell you that um my mom and dad used to have what we call now a day party uh New Year's Day for many years they invited all of their clients they of course wasn't they were in real estate business so they invite um their sales force and family and friends and hundred people or more would come by New Year's Day starting at 12 noon and party all day long. And I thought wow so well now again mommy was before her time.
SPEAKER_03:Yes she was but I don't now all day long to me doesn't read day party though like there is a stop time. Oh there's my day party because for me like the the the positive of it is that I will be able to go to bed at a reasonable hour and still have a tomorrow. And if we are partying all day long then that that eliminates my tomorrow because I'll be exhausted.
SPEAKER_02:What was cool about this this was New Year's Day okay and it started at 12 noon and now the people who came probably later in the day had been up all night because it was right they hadn't slept in uh but but she had uh all these positive sayings and she had quotes and she served something called Kentucky burgoo soup which was uh something that now it was it was called Kentucky burgoo it it was uh a soup that from the state of Kentucky that had lots of different ingredients in it um it would sort of remind you of um New Orleans um kind of dish but anyway it was it was good it was wonderful and so people would come and then you know if you say so I yeah even though I'm sure I was at these parties I can I can guess that I probably never once tasted Kentucky burgoo burdoo burgoo burgoo soup soup. Look it up okay yeah it it has some of everything in it just like gumbo does you know some of everything but it was uh that was a part of it and uh of course there is the tradition um to have um beans and to have some kind of oh the black eye peas black eye peas and the pork and you know to start out the new year too so should chitlins a new year's thing uh for some they are not for me but um I feel like we have family members that have oh yeah either suggested that yeah yeah so um do you remember your first time being exposed to chitlins yes uh Aunt Ruby uh oh Aunt Ruby was the best cook Aunt Ruby Aunt Ruby yes yes did she um were you in the house while she was cooking them or did she have you clean them because Aunt Ruby liked to um have everybody join in in the experience too. She did and uh no I was not around when she was cleaning them good never say I'm like how how deep did you go? Okay would not would have not tried it. And I don't have you tried it well yes that's why I'm what did it taste like um something that I have never eaten again so it it's not one of my delicacies but it was it was cool. It was it was uh because I could say the one time that I did that you've done I don't think I knew what it was at the time. They probably didn't tell that's true.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah that's right so um being from the South you know some people say it's a delicacy because this might have been New Year's I'm trying to I walked into one of my uncle's houses and I didn't want to be rude but I was like what is that smell I must have like whispered it to a cousin or something they're like oh that's Chitland and I was like this is what everybody's been talking about. Yeah it's a cultural thing so you know okay yeah but anyway so in 2026 try a day party if you haven't if you haven't oh yeah oh yeah I mean again the that's the preference as a matter of fact if you ask me to go somewhere after 9 p.m the likelihood of me saying yes is it continues to decline. It really does.
SPEAKER_02:You're just in your early going into your early 40s you you should be able to you know party like you just don't care.
SPEAKER_03:You know I have an equal number of people telling me that I am so young but then also so old. So I don't like I don't know what I'm I keep asking I'm like so what which one am I which one am I at 39? Am I am I young you know to be you know in in these rooms or or am I or am I so old as all like the college students are like what?
SPEAKER_02:You were born in the I I think part of it was the fact that uh you've been an old soul ever since you were a little girl. I am a little elder is true. And so um uh it that's a part of what I think they're saying. And then you have you you look young and so that that's good. Take good care of yourself. And I think that helps. I think the sounding old has to do with all those things that you say you won't do or you can't do or you're tired of doing.
SPEAKER_03:So I don't think it's can't it won't do. But okay in 2026 I will commit to one day party and one nighttime party.
SPEAKER_01:For the whole year? 300 six what do you mean?
SPEAKER_03:I can um I might do more.
SPEAKER_02:Okay. Oh you might do more. Okay you're gonna be open but but I can commit to oh I see okay yes with a smiley face. Right with a smiley face that's good. As we prepare for uh what the universe has for us And how exciting we're going to embrace those different opportunities and everything, maybe with some new fashion sense. What about that?
SPEAKER_03:What's wrong with my clothes? By the way, I never mind. Don't answer that question because that is just gonna hurt my face. You and my husband read me for days about my clothes. So here we are. We have not had a conversation. I know, I understand my role as the least fashionable person in our immediate family. It's true.
SPEAKER_02:I don't think that least fashionable would be the way I would describe it. Well, between you two. I mean I I think that um the embracing of more and more casualness as you have moved from Capitol Hill and then moved from corporate, I think you just really decided to just move to another whole level.
SPEAKER_03:So well, I think that um it's not just the the nature of the work. I think it's also to your point, just like generationally, I'm a millennial and I think younger generations are embracing being more we want to be comfortable. Like, what do you care about? Do you care about the work? Or do you care about what we like? No, I don't want to act like what you look like and how you present and what you wear doesn't matter because I am highly aware that it does, particularly for women. Um and I do like my things. It's just I find shopping to be exhausting. And now I did now with online shopping, it's better. The way you were looking at me is hilarious, by the way. So you know, I'm just like, because I do like my husband is a shopper. You are a shopper. I don't know if I would describe myself as a shopper.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I would say that um I shop in two ways. Uh, if there's something I need because I am going a particular place and I want to make sure that I am um playing the part or looking the part or having the part so that I'm comfortable. I shop for me, I shop for comfort, but I also um I like to be able to take the time to um to look a certain kind of way. I always have.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, yes, you yes, yes, you always have. I think I operate in extremes. I think I am either looking the way I want to look and present excellently, or I am uh in baggy sweats that could be my husband's clothes, could be my dad's clothes. You know, I just and I am heat company.
SPEAKER_02:What does your husband say about your fashion sense?
SPEAKER_03:Um, he had lots of comments at the beginning of our relationship, but I like they didn't move me one way or another. So probably at this point he's like, well, clearly she's gonna do what she wants to do. Um, but also I think it has to do with like some body positivity things as well. Like, so when I am more fit and feeling better, I think I I dress better and I look better and I wear more form-fitting things, and I'm not wearing what I have been told I sometimes like wear bags of clothes and things like that. So uh that plays a role for me as well.
SPEAKER_02:Well, I can tell you that, and perhaps it's my fault because you rebelled as a child. I used to dress you in these cute little outfits and I'd have hats and everything. And two minutes after I put the hat on you, I don't even know how you got it off so fast.
SPEAKER_03:Like, wasn't there a hat with that outfit?
SPEAKER_02:Yeah, exactly, exactly. But um, so um, and then you went to uh I think somewhat extreme when you began to go to college uh to be more and more.
SPEAKER_03:I mean, I wouldn't call it extreme, but I would say become like that's been consistent. Like out in college, I was either dressing to go to whatever work or or out with friends or things, or when I was going to class, I was in my my sweats and all the time. All the time, but also in part that's functional because that's also where I started my my workout routine outside of well within sports, but also outside of sports too, and it's just more practical. And you're like, uh-huh, okay. If you say so. I mean, it's comfort. I wanted to be able to run around campus in a certain type of way, you know, it just until and I did.
SPEAKER_02:And it was probably beneficial to be at an all-girls school too, because you were not dressing for attention from the male, um, you know, the male gays.
SPEAKER_03:But also, I mean, I went straight from undergrad into law school, and I don't know that my aesthetic changed. I I think I graduated from to sweatshirts and leggings versus baggy um sweatpants and bag, but still the sweatshirt never changed.
SPEAKER_02:You probably still have it today.
SPEAKER_03:Yeah, maybe, maybe, yeah.
SPEAKER_02:So, but I I I think it's important for individuals to not only be comfortable, but also what is the statement that you want to make based on how you look? So if you spend all the time that um that you need to on making sure that you're healthy, that you are taking care of your body in the ways that we've talked about, then you can complement all that good hard work and all those wonderful, really healthy meals that you have by dressing a certain kind of way so that you feel good.
SPEAKER_03:I mean, how did you get your fashion sense? Because you are you've always been um, you know, extremely fashionable.
SPEAKER_02:Uh that was something that I think uh my mother had. No, no, no, mommy had it. And she she was um she was a little fashionista at her four foot eleven, so um, and uh she liked to um to dress. And so I like to dress. And we like to shop and uh at a certain point. She used to take you shopping, remember? Yeah, and think about how she would dress when she would take you shopping.
SPEAKER_03:That's true, yes. Sometimes in all leather. Um your grandmother in all leather. Yeah, yeah, and she looked good, not that mad at it.
SPEAKER_02:A hat, she'd have, you know, she'd always have a hat on.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, that's true. Yeah, I think, but it must be like it must be a comfort thing because I can do all of what you do and what my grandmother did, but I just doing it all the time, I do find to be exhausting.
SPEAKER_01:Yes.
SPEAKER_03:But you're like Donica, you find everything to be exhausting. That was exactly my thought.
SPEAKER_02:That was exactly the thought. But I said, I'm not gonna say that. I'm not gonna say that because I love you for who you are and I raised you to be who you are. So uh, but that's okay. Uh, what we want is for folks to just, you know, be them, do it, do what they want to do and be comfortable with it. But I brought it up because I I think that a part of your creative imaginative side can be really expressed in the clothes you wear and and how you look. And so a part of my intention in 2026 is to really go back and do some of those creative things that I used to do and some fun things. And so, yeah.
SPEAKER_03:So you're gonna yeah, I mean, and I'm like, you're gonna do you're going to do this through fashion. Oh my god, no, I really can't wait. Well, fashion and whatever. Fashion and whatever. You know, but you know, I so you say uh, you know, like own who you are through fashion, express yourself through fashion. This came up in a leadership program um that I that I'm in for. Uh it's for women, but actually that might be moot. Um and the idea bring your whole self to work. And so it's for me, like when you said express yourself through fashion, I'm like, well, sometimes, but you know, don't show you don't necessarily show up looking crazy to a workplace. But then looking crazy means different things to different people.
SPEAKER_02:Well, we talked about Michelle Obama's book, The Look. And one of the comments that she made in the book was that regardless of what she said, before anyone would absolutely hear her, yeah, they commented on the way she looked.
SPEAKER_03:So just keep that in mind till the I was gonna say young people, but I guess like people in general. Like it does matter. Yeah, for sure.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, and she felt comfortable, she and Michelle Obama comfortable now to write the book because she wanted us, those who had an opportunity to not only um admire her from afar, but today to be able to understand how you look impacts what you say, how people listen, how you present yourself, how seriously you're taken in a given situation. Is it fair? No. Is it right? Not necessarily, but it is. And so in a society where everybody has a camera, and we said earlier, everybody has an opinion, so just decide what you want your statement to be. That's why.
SPEAKER_03:Love that's important.
SPEAKER_02:I mean, period. All right, so off and running in 2026.
SPEAKER_03:Happy New Year!
SPEAKER_02:Happy New Year.
SPEAKER_03:I will see you in 2026.
SPEAKER_02:Yes, we look forward to it.
SPEAKER_03:Yes, please feel free to like and subscribe if you enjoyed the conversation, and we will see you next week.
SPEAKER_00:She's got wisdom. She's got deck, she's got questions, she's got that. Two boys just gonna lie, like wisdom Steve comment, that's a key.
